Am I the last of my kind?
After you get past the obvious response of 'God, I hope so', I've been following with semi-interest some of the recent conditioning posts by George and Gwen and I realize that I just don't have that kind of dedication to conditioning in me. I am well aware of the public perception of my athleticism, witness other posts such as this one by the Bravo guys, or (insert multiple links here, as Jim would say). THis is not to say that I don't work out. I just do the track workouts that the team assigns during the season, the sprints during practices, etc. I don't do offseason stuff nor do I work out on my own during the season. Bryan Doo, now the trainer for the Celtics, rejuvenated my career in '02 when he started doing agilities which catered to my requirements as opposed to the usual track workout.
Interestingly enough, I think it was 60 minutes this weekend that had an Andy Rooney piece on how sports were evolving towards an emphasis on the 'physical' almost to the exclusion of everything else, alluding to fireballing pitchers and Doug Flutie among others or how the newest quarterbacks are the size of what an offensive lineman use to be. Would a Greg Maddux really be able to actually make it to the major leagues anymore? But I digress.
I played ultimate a couple of times in high school, but it was 10 on 10 or 11 on 11, and I sat back and hucked it to the tall guy (surprise, surprise). All backhand of course. After going off to Princeton fall '84 and quickly realizing I wasn't even going to make the JV tennis team much less varsity, I saw a poster up during freshman week for Ultimate, went out to practice, and never missed a practice for the rest of my college career, even during the spring of my senior year when I was nursing a heel injury for much of the spring. I was fortunate to get to play with the French national team at Worlds in '86 and '88 and had my formative years greatly enhanced by playing in the Westchester and New York City Summer leagues with some of the greats during college. Yes, I even played on a team with John Gewirtz for a summer.
The summer league and worlds opportunities definitely cemented in me a desire to play high level ultimate, and I'll be the first to admit that I followed a charmed path from Wild Veal (NY fall 88) to Earth Atomizer (spring 89-Fall 91) to the 92/93 pre DoG merger teams, and then DoG. I hung out with the right people, didn't completely play myself off of a team, had a couple of fortuitous breaks (including getting cut from Z {the Boston version in 89, thanks to Ted Munter, my current coach}, but that's another story) and eventually wormed my way into the starting offensive linenup on the preDoG teams and then on DoG as a handler.
You could have a good debate on whether I filled a role the team was looking for, or whether I created that role and have 'molded' the team so that the role is still applicable (I would probably lean towards b). I watch other elite teams and don't really see too many people doing what I do, or at least the same way. And of course I always speculated in the later 90s that if I actually moved to another city, whether I would even make the top team in that city. Jim and I definitely had some amusing conversations over that.
I'm not exactly sure where I'm going with this, except to speculate that the opportunity for somebody with my combination of skills to get to this level of the game has probably disappeared. I think there was another post or rsd talking about how colleges should be much more willing to take great athletes and create the disc skills rather than take somebody with disc skills (which I didn't even really have back then, definitely no forehand when I started freshman year) and try to 'make' them into an athlete, which isn't really practical and that the people that had shown up with disc skills didn't end up nearly as useful as the athletes with nothing.
On the one hand, I think it is great that sport is evolving in such a way that players are getting a lot more athletic, or rather that the median athleticism is increasing. I think the top athletes back in the '80s/'90s are comparable to those ot today, just that there is a much deeper pool now. However, it makes me a little wistful also as I look back on the opportunities, friendship, teammates, and success that ultimate has provided for me and realize that if were 15-20 years younger, I probably wouldn't be able to reach this level. Interestingly enough, even at the tender age of 38 I played probably some of my best ultimate the last two seasons at Nationals. As what ended up being the primary handler at Nationals this year, I only had 3 turnovers while probably having more touches than anyone else. While having the most touches was no different than what I was doing during the run in the '90s, the paucity of turnovers was definitely not.
So, my question stands, am I the last of my kind? Are there any other players out there like me working there way up through the ranks? Or is it all athletes all the time now. I guess I'm thinking more of the elite college, elite open at this point. Who is the young buck out there that is a member of their own 'Tea Party', perhaps a little rotund, blah, blah, blah.
Interestingly enough, I think it was 60 minutes this weekend that had an Andy Rooney piece on how sports were evolving towards an emphasis on the 'physical' almost to the exclusion of everything else, alluding to fireballing pitchers and Doug Flutie among others or how the newest quarterbacks are the size of what an offensive lineman use to be. Would a Greg Maddux really be able to actually make it to the major leagues anymore? But I digress.
I played ultimate a couple of times in high school, but it was 10 on 10 or 11 on 11, and I sat back and hucked it to the tall guy (surprise, surprise). All backhand of course. After going off to Princeton fall '84 and quickly realizing I wasn't even going to make the JV tennis team much less varsity, I saw a poster up during freshman week for Ultimate, went out to practice, and never missed a practice for the rest of my college career, even during the spring of my senior year when I was nursing a heel injury for much of the spring. I was fortunate to get to play with the French national team at Worlds in '86 and '88 and had my formative years greatly enhanced by playing in the Westchester and New York City Summer leagues with some of the greats during college. Yes, I even played on a team with John Gewirtz for a summer.
The summer league and worlds opportunities definitely cemented in me a desire to play high level ultimate, and I'll be the first to admit that I followed a charmed path from Wild Veal (NY fall 88) to Earth Atomizer (spring 89-Fall 91) to the 92/93 pre DoG merger teams, and then DoG. I hung out with the right people, didn't completely play myself off of a team, had a couple of fortuitous breaks (including getting cut from Z {the Boston version in 89, thanks to Ted Munter, my current coach}, but that's another story) and eventually wormed my way into the starting offensive linenup on the preDoG teams and then on DoG as a handler.
You could have a good debate on whether I filled a role the team was looking for, or whether I created that role and have 'molded' the team so that the role is still applicable (I would probably lean towards b). I watch other elite teams and don't really see too many people doing what I do, or at least the same way. And of course I always speculated in the later 90s that if I actually moved to another city, whether I would even make the top team in that city. Jim and I definitely had some amusing conversations over that.
I'm not exactly sure where I'm going with this, except to speculate that the opportunity for somebody with my combination of skills to get to this level of the game has probably disappeared. I think there was another post or rsd talking about how colleges should be much more willing to take great athletes and create the disc skills rather than take somebody with disc skills (which I didn't even really have back then, definitely no forehand when I started freshman year) and try to 'make' them into an athlete, which isn't really practical and that the people that had shown up with disc skills didn't end up nearly as useful as the athletes with nothing.
On the one hand, I think it is great that sport is evolving in such a way that players are getting a lot more athletic, or rather that the median athleticism is increasing. I think the top athletes back in the '80s/'90s are comparable to those ot today, just that there is a much deeper pool now. However, it makes me a little wistful also as I look back on the opportunities, friendship, teammates, and success that ultimate has provided for me and realize that if were 15-20 years younger, I probably wouldn't be able to reach this level. Interestingly enough, even at the tender age of 38 I played probably some of my best ultimate the last two seasons at Nationals. As what ended up being the primary handler at Nationals this year, I only had 3 turnovers while probably having more touches than anyone else. While having the most touches was no different than what I was doing during the run in the '90s, the paucity of turnovers was definitely not.
So, my question stands, am I the last of my kind? Are there any other players out there like me working there way up through the ranks? Or is it all athletes all the time now. I guess I'm thinking more of the elite college, elite open at this point. Who is the young buck out there that is a member of their own 'Tea Party', perhaps a little rotund, blah, blah, blah.
posted by Alex de Frondeville at 5:35 PM
13 Comments:
Yes, Maddux would never make it in the MLB today.
Except he is still pitching, so I have no idea what your comment is supposed to mean. Pitchers that throw strikes stil get to play today, they are called starters.
Guys that throw mid 90s are relievers.
Guys that do both are all stars.
The same thing happens in ultimate.
It is easier to teach a great athlete how to throw, then teach a fatass who can throw how to grow five inches and run faster.
Why don't you just stop playing in those dumb glasses and get some contacts? Then at least you'll look a bit more athletic.
Anonymous: My point is that Maddux wouldn't be able to make it today, but he is playing now and was in the right time window, just like I wouldn't be able to make it in today, and yet I am still playing also. BTW, I'm big-boned...
Corey: Ya know, I wore contacts from 89 to probably 2000 or more (I'd have to check the photos). Then I started just wearing them for Nationals, then I stopped wearing them completely. They dry out my eyes, which is really bad when it is windy, and I was never able to successfully use the really thin ones.
Can we get a picture of this De Frondeville guy? I want to see just how fat a guy y'all are talking about.
Al,
I appreciate self-deprecation as much as anyone, so I like this post. As I have said before, maybe on this very blog, I agree that you worked very hard in 02-03 when I managed to be a hanger-on at the Dog agility workouts. I think you were smart to focus on the type of workouts that best enhanced your game.
-G
Did you use to work out on your own before you got onto DoG, such as during middle school/high school/college?
alex is at least able to honor the 'man dance with weird guy' rochambeaux.
although, i really feel like i've absolutely read this post before...
and just checking to see if i'm being stalked, 'alex, you play really good d on the dump'
anonymous1: Buy the ultivillage disc 4, and I'm the guy jawing with Lou Burruss.
George: Fortunately we're still doing agilities, but they aren't quite as focussed or wide-ranging as what Bryan put us through, but Dylan does a pretty good job.
anonymous2: I think in college I tried to work out a couple of times at the gym. Maybe 10 years ago I went to a gym like 4 times. Each time I tried to get something going (weight lifting), it fizzled after no more than 5 visits. I have run less than 10 times in my life when it wasn't directly related to frisbee, as in a workout had been posted, etc. Once I'm done with frisbee and don't have the seasons conditioning to look forward to every year, that will probably have to change, but...
Luke: hell, after a while we all just repeat ourselves in these blogs, don't we? Perhaps it's only the conclusion that changes. And thanks for the compliment on my dump d (I think...)
All this talk about working out is just plain silly. As my man Hereford once said "It's only a damn frisbee!" Play your silly reindeer games in the open division, grow older, and once you've had enough of all that work (rhymes with "this sucks!") and have finally figured out this great game is nothing more than a good excuse to get together with some buds and ditch the home worries for a few days and hoist a few brews then you big boys may wise up and realize you have what it takes to become a full-blown Kegworker. C'mon...you have the skill set, you probably like beer, getting fat ain't all bad and you get to go pound on the likes of Moons, Ricks, O'Dowd and CVH in Florida without too much effort. Skipping the tofu and headed straight to the cheesecake tonight!
Admittedly masters has its attractions, and I suspect I will do a few rounds of that once I'm done with open...
Alex,
Interesting post. I have had the same discussion with Worm. We both agreed that, if the sport continues to grow as it is, then there will come a time in the near future when neither he nor I could play at the top level even in our prime. Worm claims he's too slow to keep up with the speedsters. I know that I am too short. Hell, looking at the Nationals rosters the past couple of years, there was only one other player in Open that was as short as me (5'-6" ... and a 1/4).
Although, it is also funny to see how my own role on teams has changed as I have aged and slowed down.
Start out as the eager, tireless defender of squirrelly cutters. Then gravitate towards being more of a defensive handler ("We can afford to put him on a slower guy"). Finally, this past year, I caught every pull for Tampa ("Let's just hope we don't turn it over so he doesn't have to play D").
Let's just say, I'm glad I got into the sport when I did.
-Billy
Billy: I definitely agree with that. I think I hit the perfect career window. As for roles, well, I've been doing the same thing for about the last 17 years. I guess that happens when you start playing Open as an offensive handler. There really is no where to go from there.
I would sooner play on the D team that have to play handler.
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